• s20@lemmy.ml
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    1 year ago

    I agree with everything but the “it makes no difference” part. Thinking it makes no difference is a privilege a whole shit ton of people can’t afford.

    They’re both horrible. Capitalism sucks. But to say there’s no difference? That’s just delusional. You’re missing the trees for the forest.

    Until that “true change” you’re talking about happens, I’m not willing to sit by and let women, immigrants, minorities, and LGBTQIA+ people get fucked over even worse than I am. And fuck you if you are.

    • barrbaric [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      1 year ago

      Roe V Wade was repealed under Biden. The concentration camps at the border are still open. In response to the mass murder of black people by cops, Biden gave more money to the cops. The extermination of trans people is continuing apace at the state level and the dems are doing nothing to stop it. This is all to say nothing about foreign policy, where the US is still complicit with killing thousands if not millions since 2020 through sanctions and facilitating genocide in Yemen. Or lifting all COVID restrictions despite the massive danger still posed.

      There is a rhetorical difference between the two parties, but there isn’t much evidence of a material difference.

      • s20@lemmy.ml
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        1 year ago

        Okay.

        What word did I say that made you think I’m happy with the Democrats? That I actually support them rather than hate them just marginally less than the fascists in the other party?

        It’s all fucked. And the Supreme Court was stacked by the last administration, so you’re arguing against yourself buddy.

        • barrbaric [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          1 year ago

          What word did I say that made you think I’m happy with the Democrats?

          I never said you were. I was addressing the claim that they’re a lesser evil, which I’m not convinced by.

          It’s all fucked.

          Agreed!

          And the Supreme Court was stacked by the last administration

          Largely irrelevant. Biden could stack the court, or just tell them to fuck off since they have no real power, or codified Roe into law when the dems controlled congress. There are excuses for why they couldn’t do any of those things, sure (not least of which that Biden opposes abortion rights himself because he’s a fucking monster). But all of them show that they’re fundamentally unserious in fighting back against the fascists. I’m not going to vote for von Hindenburg 2.

    • nat_turner_overdrive [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      1 year ago

      Until that “true change” you’re talking about happens, I’m not willing to sit by and let women, immigrants, minorities, and LGBTQIA+ people get fucked over even worse than I am. And fuck you if you are.

      Did you vote for Biden? So you voted and still got roe v wade overturned. You voted and Biden has continued the staggering majority of Trump’s inhumane border policies. You voted, and we’re one well-timed court case away from the SC overturning gay marriage. Congratulations, the better guy won and all the same shit happened.

      • s20@lemmy.ml
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        1 year ago

        you voted and still got roe v wade overturned.

        Roe v Wade got overturned by a Supreme Court that was stacked by the Republicans during the previous administration you absolute waste. You’re literally arguing against your own point.

        And again: what fucking part of any fucking word I’ve typed makes you think I’m happy with the Biden administration.

        Oh, wait! You’re not actually reading anything I’m saying! You’re just shifting goalposts and regurgitating talking points! Holy fuck, it’s like talking to a communist version of my mother.

        Don’t talk to me unless you actually know something. Take your useless idealism elsewhere.

        • nat_turner_overdrive [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          1 year ago

          Roe v Wade got overturned by a Supreme Court that was stacked by the Republicans during the previous administration you absolute waste. You’re literally arguing against your own point.

          And what is your vote doing to stop that? Anything at all?

          Oh, wait! You’re not actually reading anything I’m saying! You’re just shifting goalposts and regurgitating talking points! Holy fuck, it’s like talking to a communist version of my mother.

          I’m reading what you’re saying, it’s just so dumb and trite it might as well be embroidered on a tea cozy

          • s20@lemmy.ml
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            1 year ago

            I’m reading what you’re saying, it’s just so dumb and trite it might as well be embroidered on a tea cozy

            The fact that I feel the same way about you probably indicates that this is a pointless waste of time on all sides.

            And what is your vote doing to stop that? Anything at all?

            In the Biden election? Nothing. Roe was done for as soon as Trump won. It was on life support, but people refusing to vote for the lesser of two evils pulled the plug.

            I’m tired dude. I’m just so fucking tired.

            Do what you want. You’re not gonna accomplish any more than I am so I’m not sure why I cared enough to get worked up. We’re all fucked no matter what. Do your little protest vote or whatever the fuck. I’m sure it’s gonna do so fucking much.

            • nat_turner_overdrive [he/him]@hexbear.net
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              1 year ago

              Roe was done for as soon as Trump won.

              Why did Trump win? Did it have anything to do with the Clinton campaign choosing a pied pipe strategy where they boosted everything Trump did in the primary and ignored all the less fascist candidates? Do you suppose that continuing to use that tactic is good? The Democrats continue to use their donations to amplify the furthest right candidates in races, and they do not have anywhere near a 100% success rate in defeating those fascists they intentionally amplify. To make the point, money given to the DNC is, in some small proportion, money given to the RNC because the DNC would prefer to amplify worst case scenarios to improve their chances instead of offering GOOD CANDIDATES to entice voters. Supporting that is supporting the rightward slide of everything.

              It was on life support, but people refusing to vote for the lesser of two evils pulled the plug.

              That’s one way to see it - the same way the DNC paid pundits and managers see it, since it validates them. Another way to see it is, the Democrats steadfastly refuse to offer a better alternative.

              Do your little protest vote or whatever the fuck. I’m sure it’s gonna do so fucking much.

              You know that voting for Biden resulted in a worse world, and here you are sneering at anyone who thinks that was a waste.

              edit: let’s address Obama, too - he had a fucking SC appointment, and instead of doing anything serious to seat a good candidate, he fucking punted on the assumption - the incredibly stupid assumption - that Clinton would win. Obama is why Roe is gone. So your vote for Obama was also a vote for letting Republicans pick a SC candidate. Can’t you connect the dots? It doesn’t matter how hard you vote for Democrats. They will always let the Republicans win, because they’re both paid by the same masters.

              You’re not gonna accomplish any more than I am so I’m not sure why I cared enough to get worked up

              one more edit: the distinction is you keep repeating shit everybody knows, whereas I (and other leftists) are trying to explain you to a new concept. It’s clear you’re not listening, but I’ll keep trying until you give up.

              • s20@lemmy.ml
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                1 year ago

                the distinction is you keep repeating shit everybody knows, whereas I (and other leftists) are trying to explain you to a new concept

                I keep repeating shit because you keep not hearing me. You still think I’m trying to defend the Democratic party. You still think I find the Biden administration defendable. If you understand “lesser of two evils” so well, why do you think I’m trying to defend a party I keep calling evil?

                So I’ll tell you what, I’ll deal with the “new concept” part of what you said when you explain that to me. Once I understand why you think I’m defending a position that I haven’t once defended, I might be able to move on.

                • nat_turner_overdrive [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                  1 year ago

                  You, a smart guy: you should vote for Biden because lesser evil

                  Me, a complete idiot: no, you should not

                  You, a very smart guy: NUH UH I NEVER SAID YOU SHOULD, I DON’T HAVE TO DEFEND THE PERSON I SAID YOU SHOULD VOTE FOR

                  • s20@lemmy.ml
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                    1 year ago

                    I didn’t say Biden. I never said Biden. I never brought up his name. I at no point defended the actions of his administration or his party.

                    All I said is that the other guy is worse, which means you vote to try to have it not be the worse one. That’s explicitly not a defense of any party. It’s an attack on them both. I’d repeat my initial phrase, but apparently even though everyone seems to think it means I’m defending someone, trying to drive it home has gotten me labeled a congenital idiot.

                    And you’ve been misrepresenting me and jumping up and down on me ever since.

                    And nobody has presented me with a better option. They just keep calling me names, saying I’m repeating myself, and saying “they’re all the same” and “Biden bad!”

                    So please, for the next election, give me an action I can take that has some sort or hope of getting us all out of this collective shit show.

          • ZodiacSF1969@sh.itjust.works
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            1 year ago

            Lmao I can’t wait until you and your comrades try to start the revolution, shit is going to be hilarious 🤣

            Also why tf does everyone on hexbear put their pronouns in their username on a site that emphasizes anonymous interactions. No one cares about what you like to be called.